Is it reasonable to think I can make a profit reselling Dayi puer?
So I live in China and here we have a big sale time coming up, giving me an opportunity to buy puer directly from Dayi at a steep discount. Is it reasonable to think I can bring it back into the states and sell it at a profit? Is it even possible to bring a significant amount back to the states without being hit with taxes? I’m not talking an insane amount, maybe in the neighborhood of 10 lbs or so. I definitely would declare it (not comfortable misrepresenting myself).
Hoping for your honest input. If I can’t make money off of it, I still want to bring it back to store it for when I move back to the states in 2 years or so.
I think any problems you might have as far as customs would be on the Chinese end, as tea is considered a controlled export (technically). You’ll probably be fine if it’s just 10 lbs. How are you planning on reselling it? I’d stick to recipes that move fast. Nowadays a lot of people who are into pu buy China direct and prices are much more competitive now than they used to be (but of course, not as cheap as buying directly in China)!
Thanks for the reply. I was thinking either selling on eBay or here, but I don’t have experience with this in regards to tea. I was thinking of the following:
2016 “0532” ripe puer (probably get a lot of this one)
V93 ripe tuocha
2015 “7542” raw puer
2016 “golden needle white lotus” ripe puer – batch 1401 (thinking about a lot of this one, especially because I like to drink higher grade ripes)
2014 “Menghai star”
2016 “yu gong yuan Cha” batch 1501 (200g/bing)
I’m really not familiar with the recipes that people buy a lot of. Mind sharing?
Also, any experience bringing tea out of China? Would 20 lbs be pushing it?
Well I live in Hong Kong and get my tea shipped directly over from Dayi. I’d think after fees, you’d be making $5-10 a cake. I’d stick to high end stuff since the margin is higher. Check out eBay prices and see if this is really worth your while. You might be better off taking tea home for yourself
If you are able to get them at below market price you may be able to make a profit. As to carrying them through customs you may have a problem. I know there is a limit of how much you can bring into the country as duty free goods. I think it’s something like $600 but I am just guessing at the number.
If you have the product shipped it is different and you would probably pay no duty. But check with US Customs for how much you can bring into the country duty free.
Again, if you ship it I think there is no duty on tea. I recently put in a very big order with Yunnan Sourcing, about $700. I was told by Scott that there is no duty on tea. But I do not know if this applies to what you carry in.
Yes it’s definitely below market, some cakes way below (V93 is about 1/4 of the normal price). I’m concerned about the price thing though. I guess I need to look that up
I don’t even bother trying to sell new Dayi since I’m not going to compete with sellers in Guangzhou and Kunming who sell at pretty low margins. A lot of pu buyers here buy directly from these sellers after finding them on Aliexpress and eBay (the prices are better directly through them).
I do have several tongs of Dayi and Xiaguan tea aging away, though, and will buy more for Singles Day if the deals are good ;) What kind of discounts are you expecting on 11/11?
I’ve had great experiences with aging pu over the last several years here in HK. I got some 2005 CNNP 7581s in that were undrinkable from Kunming dry storage, but after eight months here, they are already good, and will probably be excellent in another year or two.
So it looks like tea does not have import duties on it. Am I reading this wrong? https://hts.usitc.gov/view/Chapter%209
Looks like it! Interesting that there is only duty on green tea. I think the $800 limit still applies to goods bought outside the US and brought home in baggage, though, regardless of duty. I could be wrong!
You can always get around the customs duty by having the tea shipped to yourself in the states. I have been told by Scott at Yunnan Sourcing that there is no tax on tea brought in to the country by mail. Scott has explained that he ships huge amounts of tea to himself and never gets charged tax.
Wouldn’t that be super expensive? I assume the shipping costs of 10-20 lbs of puer would be huge?
You could ship by surface mail and it would get there in 3-4 months ;) I like using surface mail from China—it only takes two-to-three weeks to HK!
Surely surface will take less time than that, but as the plan is to maximise the profit, it would appear best to carry as much as possible and ship any leftovers by surface.
I’ve had surface take 3-4 months from Indonesia, so China to the US might take even longer!
https://www.travelchinaguide.com/essential/postal-service/
I think between 1 to 2 months is normal for surface, to any country, but yeah, I suppose it is also common enough to be further delayed. I’m used to things often taking twice normal shipping times to get to me for that matter.
In any case, based on the points you have made, it appears best to carry $800 worth in the baggage and have the rest shipped by surface for maximum savings.
I’m pretty sure Yunnan Sourcing warns surface will take 3-4 months from China on their site!
That’s a little better! I guess there are enough ships heading to the US from China so they can load mail on a little quicker.
Big vendors in Southern China sell those tea much cheaper than TMall, so the price you get the tea from Dayi “directly” would still be higher than retail price on some reputable dealer.
You also have to front the money, shipping…the profit margin would be low.
Where are you going to sell it?
Online – how are you going to reach out of your local customer, many non-Chinese tea drinkers are buying directly from Taobao with a Taobao agent.
An actual shop – rent, bills..etc
Just my $0.02 :-)
I’ve never seen anyone selling real Dayi tea for this cheap. Not even close. I live in China so I have a pretty good idea of the prices. Resellers are notoriously unreliable here, especially when it comes to a brand like Dayi.
I wouldn’t be shipping, just bringing it in. I’m thinking less than $800 would be fine. I’m not trying to make a ton of money, just a few hundred to help me move after I get back.
As far as where to sell, I’m thinking either eBay or here. I’m not going to be moving a lot, maybe 3-4 tong of golden needle white lotus (high end) and some other mid-level cakes as well. This isn’t a long-term operation, just a way to make a few hundred to help my transition back into the states :)
I wish Dayi would consider opening up a shop in the USA, maybe New York City would be a perfect place for one.
If you are trying to make a profit selling from the US remember that the prices of the USPS are very high. You may find that people don’t want to pay high shipping for something they can get shipped from China pretty cheap in many cases. I just sent about 1 kg of tea to someone in the US, A medium flat rate box was around $14. In this box you could of course fit about three full bings so it might be worth it for someone buying several teas from you. And I definitely think you can try to sell teas here on Steepster. However, people may not want to select the send to family and friends option for money for then they have no buyer protection. So expect to pay Paypal fees if you are going to sell through Steepster.It is actually cheaper to send one tea from China via E Packet than sending that same tea across the USA via the USPS.
Allan, that’s a very good point. Now that I have the HK version of ePacket set up, I am amazed at how much of a savings it is over sending mail the regular way.
For the record, Dayi stores aren’t all that—even in Kunming, they have a limited selection of cakes and years on offer, and prices are higher than online from China.
The stores are run by businessmen who are licensed by Dayi. They only sell real tea as part of their license agreement (there is a LOT of fake Dayi tea out there, complete with stickers and holograms and all). The stores have minimum pricing requirements set by Dayi and only stock what they can afford to. I believe they have minimum purchase requirements to meet as well.
We have official Dayi stores here in Hong Kong, but I’ve never been to one. I have had the local distributor send me tea, but the prices were MUCH higher than what I pay to have an authorized dealer send me Dayi tea directly from Kunming. The best prices on Dayi tea are from retailers who are NOT officially licensed by Dayi as they set their own prices, but there’s also a risk of fakes that way.
I went to a tea market right across the border from here (Shenzhen) and shockingly all of the stores I went into had really bad fake tea! I only checked out 5-10% of the market, but it was a horrifying experience.
I have no doubt it is easy to get fooled and get a fake. I have had questionable teas before. Now that the fakers are doing holograms it is really hard to tell. I do tend to buy ripe teas and I know raw teas are more likely to be faked because there is more money in it. In general the only way to gauge if an online store is selling real tea or fake is by how it is wrapped. But this can be faked too. I mostly only buy Dayi from stores I really trust like Yunnan Sourcing, Berylleb King Tea on EBay, or King Tea on Aliexpress.
Sticking with tried and true suppliers is the safest way to go! My first pu erh cake was a fake 2005 7542 and I’ve had it aging away for years. It does taste like a 7542 but it’s…different.
Down here in HK, people have even been sold fake Red Marks and the like at full market price. I prefer to buy new and aged dry storage tea from reputable dealers and age it myself nowadays, or buy aged teas from HK dealers who sell tea of known quality and where fakes aren’t a concern.
Chinese markets, on the other hand, are really tricky places. You have extremely good dealers next door to scam artists. They even fake milk and soy sauce up there, so a little pu erh trickery is a possibility, and in some places, a probability!
eBay is 10% fees and PayPal is 3%. Just to keep in mind. Also, Chinese sellers offer free shipping on most teas so be prepared to compete with that.
I don’t know how well you know puerh, but looking for more unusual teas that are hard to find might be a better option. To do that, you would need to know what is uncommon. For example, I bought a Liu Pao brick from a guy in Florida who had two or three, and I’ve never seen that one anywhere else. So in that case I was willing to pay the shipping cost. I imagine other people would pay whatever you ask if the tea unavailable elsewhere.
I received the first part of the order. Just 3 cakes left. Turns out the “Golden Needle White Lotus” cakes are all 2014. I got 3 tongs (plus 3 separate bings), plus a tong of 2016 0532 (and 3 more cakes on the way). I’ll be holding on to this until 2018 most likely. It’s going to be hard not to drink it all myself!
http://imgur.com/sKYCxqp
http://imgur.com/qOK57eB
I’m thinking of storing these on an open closet shelf (to avoid sun) in their tong wrappers in an open cardboard box. The closet doesn’t have any weird smells or anything. The golden needle white lotus will be in their cardboard boxes within the other cardboard box, but I’ll leave the tops open as well. I run a humidifier on the lowest setting at night during the dry season here. Seems to be a pretty decent storage environment. Any ideas on improving it?
Where in China are you?
Wait, is that your proposed storage method for when you get home to the US? -Confuddled
Where in the US are you going to be. Some places like New York have high humidity only in the summer months. I have found that New Your humidity is fine for my shou and a little lacking for my sheng. Some places in the US like southern Texas will have high humidity pretty much year round.
I’m in the northeast. It’s very dry here in the winter but relatively humid in the summer. It’s suuuper dry in the winter so I have to run the humidifier so I don’t dry out and crack open haha. I’m talking about storage in China. In the states it’ll be in Tennessee so I’m not worried about humidity there at all.
You, sir, need a pumidor!
None of my 11/11 tea has been shipped yet. :o
2018 may be too early for the tea to have completely lost all fermentation aromas. It’s HOT and humid here in HK—80% humidity and 80-85 degrees today, and my V93 tuos have improved significantly, but still need another year or two to be where I want them to be. Heat and humidity make all the difference, but too much isn’t good either
Well most of the cakes will be 4 years old by then. I don’t know if I have the space for a dedicated pumidor, but I can create a big one in my room! I have a large south facing window and heated floors (so cold is never an issue) plus a humidifier. Would that be sufficient?
I went ahead and bought a hygrometer just to make sure the humidity is good. Any specific recommendations as to the range I should keep it in?
Four years in that kind of climate could have less of an effect than six months of summer down here. Seriously! I don’t know how high you can get the temperature and humidity, but 80 degrees and 70-80% humidity is a good goal. You may get some mold/bugs in your room if you’re raising the entire room to that level year round. I get little beetles crawling around through the summer, silverfish, etc. It does get cooler and drier here, but usually only for a week or two, then it gets warmer again, and it never gets below freezing here. Last year we got a little snow flurry on the tallest mountain in town, and people ran up there to experience it (and then needed help getting down, and called the cops…)
So far this fall, we’ve had one cooler day when I wore a sweatshirt (and had to take it off since I got warm pretty quickly)—it’s back up to sweltering again, and will get cooler again next week. It’s 27 degrees Celsius (81F) and 67% humidity right now.
HK is an amazing place to age pu erh—the downside is the skyhigh property costs. I should really stack tea to the ceiling myself. lol. I’m working on it!
My entire home is dehumidified, except for my bedroom, and I should probably move that tea into my pu erh storage space at my office since then I can dehumidify my bedroom as well! I decide how wide to open up the window in my bedroom by looking at the weather on a given day.
Your tea will appreciate in value even with cryostasis (what some articles online jokingly call Kunming storage) but would probably not be very pleasant to drink by 2018. Kunming is probably a better overall climate than anywhere in the northeast of China, since it’s known for its mild weather all year round. It’s one of the few places I’ve been on my recent travels where I didn’t need an air conditioner (and there weren’t any in the hotel rooms, either).
Well the indoor temperature is actually pretty steady here, it’s never cold indoors. Often it’s way too hot! The gauge I ordered should help me keep a good high level of humidity. The temp is not really a concern I think.
Temperature is of huge concern, but if you have high indoor temperatures, then you don’t need to worry about it :)
Yeah I’m actually more concerned about the temp in the states. It’s very warm inside here. How cold is too cold?
77 degrees or under will slow down aging. The lower the temperature, the slower the aging. At 50-65 degrees your tea would barely change over a decade I’d think.
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